tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post4496949006255405814..comments2023-10-08T05:00:23.559-04:00Comments on Clarissa's Blog: How to Defend Muslim Women, from Fatemeh FakhraieClarissahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11027134365260069910noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post-60541299042456078252009-07-29T14:42:58.274-04:002009-07-29T14:42:58.274-04:00"i thought she was teaching us a lesson in co..."i thought she was teaching us a lesson in compromise and keeping your eye on the prize when she submitted to the democratic left. but no --over time she taught me a much different lesson. there is a line you do not cross and stay a feminist."<br /><br />-That's exactly how I feel. I was willing to close my eyes on so many things she was doing because I believed that, in the end, she will always be better on women's issues than any male politician, no matter how well he speaks aabout them. But the you just sit there and wait and then wait some more for her to finally turn towards women, and it still isn't happening.Clarissahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11027134365260069910noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post-25526149672753343062009-07-29T14:05:49.255-04:002009-07-29T14:05:49.255-04:00i loved her as the perfect roll model - i thought ...i loved her as the perfect roll model - i thought her campaign was great actually - I am not your typical feminist. i have seen the teeth of the monster and do support the use of force --- i thought hillary would make the state dept even better than condi but she is in chains -- i thought she was teaching us a lesson in compromise and keeping your eye on the prize when she submitted to the democratic left. but no --over time she taught me a much different lesson. there is a line you do not cross and stay a feminist. no support of those you know have used sexism to gain power and those who are sympathetic to the muslin theocracies.<br /><br />but as with Bush and Condi's programs for muslim women, i will use obama where i can for women and the ecology and remain independent and a feminist. the wars of bush helped muslem women (I know the counter arguments)-- and would have done much more if the ones who took over from him would have made a real campaign for women. but no..................and hillary should cover her head in shame.Greenconsciousnesshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12972464004044369714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post-25418181875288298332009-07-29T13:44:47.224-04:002009-07-29T13:44:47.224-04:00I initially supported Hillary for president. And t...I initially supported Hillary for president. And then I saw her campaign and got profoundly disillusioned. She adopted all of the worst strategies of the "old boys' club" and magnified them by 5. The result was sad to observe.Clarissahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11027134365260069910noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post-35940372340719349522009-07-28T16:34:51.324-04:002009-07-28T16:34:51.324-04:00Of course - collaborators get hired into women stu...Of course - collaborators get hired into women studies employment by the male identified who make the decisions. That is how the intellectual class co-ops and eventually defines what threatens their territory and power. Oh it is all so civil. Like Hillary getting along to get along.Greenconsciousnesshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12972464004044369714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post-67389228571322510822009-07-28T14:56:22.599-04:002009-07-28T14:56:22.599-04:00Not only is the veil presented as a choice, I'...Not only is the veil presented as a choice, I've heard people argue that it's liberating for women. I've had a normally very lucid female professor argue passionately about the liberating qualities of the veil. It was curious, though, that she was making this argument while wearing a completely American outfit and, of course, no veil.Clarissahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11027134365260069910noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post-61037520662256419822009-07-27T15:10:05.065-04:002009-07-27T15:10:05.065-04:00What she doesn't get is that we are not speaki...What she doesn't get is that we are not speaking for Muslim women but standing in solidarity with the feminists among them. There are many angry Muslem women fighting their own oppression, w many as we saw in Iran, and in the bravery of women in Afghanistan and Iraq. All over the Islamic world women being disappeared, burned, stoned, whipped, acid burned and honor killed speak by their actions for their own liberation. When they escape they write books. We feminists, the few that do understand our rights are all connected globally, are making sure the voices of Muslim feminists are heard over the voice of the collaborators. <br /><br />I don't respect the collaborators any more than I respect the women who help the theocrats kill their daughters and co-wives. But of course left women (who self describe as feminists just as the "feminists" for life do), in obedience to their precious leader who tells them veils are a "choice" and good enough for Hillary who obediantly wears one in the middle east, would run this lecture so they can cite it when calling real feminists racist or xenophobic or Islamaphobe or imperialistic or whatever they can call us to cover their own betrayal's shame.Greenconsciousnesshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12972464004044369714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post-76622193572896235232009-07-27T10:43:31.930-04:002009-07-27T10:43:31.930-04:00That's why I am ready to give affirmative acti...That's why I am ready to give affirmative action one more generation after starting conditions will be equalized.<br />V.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post-21721546174400465982009-07-26T13:29:56.354-04:002009-07-26T13:29:56.354-04:00But what about people who aren't little kids a...But what about people who aren't little kids any more? It's late to talk about starting conditions with them.Clarissahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11027134365260069910noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post-90005002087420667512009-07-23T16:44:56.053-04:002009-07-23T16:44:56.053-04:00I acknowledge the real fact of racism. I disagree ...I acknowledge the real fact of racism. I disagree about the appropriate course of action in this respect. In my opinion, all effort should be directed into equalizing STARTING conditions. And that's it. Later-stages tinkering should gradually disappear. <br />V.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post-24864656379140276852009-07-23T11:42:01.159-04:002009-07-23T11:42:01.159-04:00I think there is a difference in acknowledging the...I think there is a difference in acknowledging the real fact of racism and suggesting something be done about it and engaging in this kind of self-flagellation that never leads to any action. Because if things change, then who will these people feel sorry for?Clarissahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11027134365260069910noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post-31376641636602246672009-07-23T08:16:49.310-04:002009-07-23T08:16:49.310-04:00The Muslim approach to feminism you described (I h...The Muslim approach to feminism you described (I have no idea how widespread it is or if it is just the personal opinion of Fakhraie) is actually quite noteworthy.<br /><br />What it is, in essence, is just "let us be Muslims", period. The feminist rhetoric is hijacked because Fakhraie believes it is the language which should be used while explaining something to feminists. It is a great illustration of what is wrong with liberal guilt rhetoric - it can be hijacked to prove anything.<br /><br />---Progressive sites are filled with people who ardently denounce themselves for being privileged and never repenting enough for that.<br /><br />In our discussion two posts below, on issue of race, you yourself exhibited exactly what I would call liberal guilt... :)<br />V.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3164556861454970487.post-45582638771384801302009-07-22T23:15:33.749-04:002009-07-22T23:15:33.749-04:00You just described the Third Wave.You just described the Third Wave.donna darkohttp://donnadarko.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.com